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We are now required to preclip???

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  • We are now required to preclip???

    Today a shih tzu came in..It has not been groomed in about a year it only had about 4-5 inches of thin coat on it so he looks like he got groomed somewhere. He had two or three bad mats which i cut off before the bath then brushed some of the other mats out..This dog was EXTREMELY dirty. I cut the mats off then threw him into tub gave him a good bath (icky dirty dog!!!) dried him a bit then put him in a cage to clean up...The manager comes in and says i have to preclip the dogs..her reasons were: if you bathe the dog with that much hair then cut it off the dog is not going to be clean all the way to the skin, he may have skin problems that you can't see, we have always done it this way and we are not changing it...She also said the groomers she knows (3 of them!) have always preclipped the dogs..
    i felt like she would not listen to me when I was trying to tell her why..I told her if the dog is dirty after the bath at the skin you are doing something wrong, then she would just go back to "this is how it always has been and we aren't changing it now"..she kept claiming the dog was really matted but i cut the mats out!!! Or she would say that using the blow drier is bad on this dog because it could knot up (which again if you do it right it's not a problem)
    I'm so flustered, the manager has never clipped a dog, so she has no idea what she is talking about..
    Is there any literature about this that I could show her? Or how could i present this to her so she understands it's not bad to not preclip?
    Sorry I'm just very frustrated i'm not sure what to do!! Should I just listen to her and preclip??

  • #2
    Dear Koda's manager

    Preclipping is old school. It is a method that was used before we in the grooming industry had the awesome equipment and products that we have today. With the high quality shampoos, conditioners, detangling sprays, force dryers, matt splitters and advanced brushes, most pre bath grooming has become obsolete. These days preclipping a dog is a waste of time and energy and causes undue wear and tear to our grooming equipment.

    I am a groomer in a top quality grooming salon in a veterinary hospital. I have 18 years of experience. I am sure other just as qualified groomers will also post the same types of comments here under Koda's original post.

    Koda I guess if you dont think you will get in trouble you could refer your manager back to this thread (or print it out for her) Unfortunately, when you choose to work for other people you are subject to their wishes. When you work for people who know nothing about grooming it can be very frustrating. Hope this helps.

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    • #3
      I'm too stubborn, I wouldn't preclip. There are a lot of threads about this topic, maybe you could print something out and bring it in. I could never work for someone like that!

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      • #4
        Is your manager old school? Jadenlea is right, there isn't a need for pre-clipping anymore. The only time I ever pre clip is if the dog is pelted, or if it is a SUPER hairy OAY shave down. Other than that I can't stand pre clipping. The other groomer I work with has been grooming for about 30 years and she likes to pre clip dogs all the time. Old habits are hard to break I suppose.

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        • #5
          Appeal to the pocketbook!

          Tell her how much the sharpening bill will go down if she tries the newer ways. and wetshaving too! I hardly ever have to get my metal blades sharpened anymore LOVE it.
          "Everyone needs something to beleive in..I beleive I need another Poodle"
          Quote:Cath

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          • #6
            One thing everybody is forgetting. If Koda is working at a corporate shop, then her manager is held by the corporate rules and procedures. It's her backside on the line if the shop is inspected and finds someone not grooming by the "rules". Regardless if preclipping is old school or not. Corporate rulemakers are notoriously slow to adopt efficient, new procedures. I've battled with one district manager who, "never wanted to see hair on the floor". That's why I own my own shop now

            Best wishes on your situation.

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            • #7
              Personally I still preclip in some cases.

              I've had dogs come in that have nothing but an inch thick layer of matt's covering their entire body, Bathing is not going to get it out unless you spend HOURS in there... the best thing to for the dogs in question was to shave them down, Im not going to waste numerous hours in the bathtub to clean a dog that is going to be shaved to the skin anyways.

              I understand your case Boscoandkoda, you shouldn't ALWAYS preclip a dog, especially if they are relatively clean, only have a few matts and most of the hair is going to be kept, if anything a bath should be first in almost all cases.

              But even with the best equipment known to the grooming business, we all still have a case or two where the dog should be shaved first, i would rather risk the blade, then my time and the dog's pain in the first place.

              Plus i live in the Appalachia (southern ohio) and my business is part of an Animal Hospital, so i have seen my fair share of dogs needing preclipped.

              The worst cases I have seen were actually dogs with Mange, I have had to shave a few at work, One was a Shiba Enu who needed water therapy, in that case, the dog had to be shaved with a #40 blade all over, then had to have water therapy, luckily i used the clinic clippers and blades, that was the worst thing i have ever had to do to (or FOR) a dog in my career..

              Basically what im getting to, there are cases where preclipping needs to be done...just not all the time...

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              • #8
                I pre-clip probably about 1/2 the dogs i do...its such a toss up....faster to cut clean hair....or .....faster to dry short hair...it totally depends on the dog IMO but i am far from experienced...only been grooming 3 years

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                • #9
                  I have only been grooming four years but I do find that I preclip. There is no need for me to HV a dog for way longer than I need to just to snap on my attachment and take half of it off after drying them forever. I don't see the point in bathing a full coated dog wasteing all the water and some shampoo and drying time as well. Now the owners that I do on a regular basis and the get a trim I don't pre clip. Also being mobile it saves me time if I don't have to dry more hair than need be also I don't care what kind of equipment you have there is no way you can tell me if you do a shave down without a pre clip that it takes you the same amount of time because your not having to dry three inches of hair and undercoat. It's not old school to me just effective. If you lube your blades there should be no issues.....

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                  • #10
                    Generally I don't preclip; it's easier to just throw them in the tub and then clip them. If they're matted then I do preclip; I will also preclip if they're regular cleints and like them shaved down to nothing so they're a quick and easy finish.
                    ~*~*~Shawn, C.M.G.~*~*~
                    Apparently common sense isn't all that common
                    *~*~emipoo on egroomer*~*~*

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                    • #11
                      The reason I did not preclip was because the dogs hair was gross and greasy, it had thin hair that dries very fast so i did not worry about drying time...I do preclip some dogs, obviously matted dogs, and thick coated dogs..i just didn't feel the need to preclip this one since it was so dirty!!

                      Thanks for the advice..i will definitly print out some things and bring it to work..hopefully she will understand, i don't really see what the big deal is..i guess that's my problem..
                      I understand not wanting to waste shampoo, but again thin hair so i didn't use that much more shampoo, (maybe a little more though!)

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                      • #12
                        Sure you are right but -

                        The manager is the manager and will not care what you show him/her to prove that you are right. In fact, it will become worse.

                        How about agreeing with the manager and then doing what you want?

                        How about talking with the other groomers and finding out what they do? Then you can use them as "backup" and tell the manager that it's SOOOO confusing with different people telling you different things!!

                        How about doing some easy pre-clips (or pretending to) when you think he/she is watching, just to keep the peace and look like a good little order-taker?

                        Sucks, but that's life.

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                        • #13
                          Yes pre-clipping is old school,However the reason we do it is why wash all that hair if your going to cut it off anyways yes it takes time before the bath but the dry and finish time is sped up tremendously .I pre clip all dogs clipped #4 or shorter guard cuts I wash first then clip.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Poodleboy60 View Post
                            One thing everybody is forgetting. If Koda is working at a corporate shop, then her manager is held by the corporate rules and procedures.
                            of the big 2 neither require that you preclip.

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                            • #15
                              I would have bathed first too.

                              I went right away from pre-clipping. And suddenly i'm finding i'm doing it again. I don't know what i'm doing wrong, but when I wet clip, it's taking me longer (unless the dog is matted), and then I have to dry the blade and oil it, which takes a minute or so. The hair is catching in the blades, and combs, and i have to stop and clean the blade/comb multiple times during the clip. (i'm wondering if it's the conditioner) So a lot of dogs, as long as they aren't super curly, or matted, are getting pre-clipped, and i'm back to 8 dogs a day.

                              A dirty, greasy dog would still have gone straight into the tub. cause that too would have clogged my blades, and i'd rather clean out the clean wet hair, than dirty greasy hair.

                              I always remove matts after a bath though... I don't de-matt anything before the bath. If the dog had matts, and you pre-clip it, you can't see the skin, and you don't know what's in that hair. If the dog has been washed, and force dried until damp you can see the matts, and what's around them, and it's safer... if the dog is REALLY matted, then I bath, rinse, force dry until damp, shave, and then bath it again. And then you can see the skin and if you need to use an oatmeal, or you find bugs or other nasties, you can decide your next plan of attack, but at least the dog isn't covered in matts anymore.

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