Announcement

**Chuck** · 03-31-07, 06:53 AM

I do not understand?

In one breath they say:

Nutro's dry pet foods do NOT contain wheat gluten.
Nutro's dry pet foods do NOT contain imported grains.
Nutro's dry pet foods are NOT manufactured by Menu Foods.
None of Nutro's dry pet foods are included on the Menu Foods recall list.
Pet owners should feel safe and confident feeding all Nutro dry pet foods, as well as any Nutro wet foods that are not on the Menu Foods recall list.

But then they say:

For a list of Nutro products included in the recall, as well as further information about Nutro and how its products are affected by the Menu Foods recall, please visit www.nutroproducts.com or call 1- 800-833-5330.
Our team of customer care representatives is working diligently to respond to each and every email personally. We ask for your patience during this very unfortunate situation.

In addition, as we have always done, Nutro will treat its customers fairly and with compassion. Those who have suffered through an illness or death of their pet and feel a Nutro product in any way contributed to that illness or death should contact us directly through our Consumer Service Department at 800-833-5330. These requests will be resolved as quickly as possible and we apologize for any delays our customers may be experiencing when contacting us.

Do they or don't they have foods that are manufactured by Menu Foods and what are they? I think by starting off about how safe some of their foods are and then not saying what foods they sell that are is totally irresponsible of them. I do not want to know which foods are safe or how concerned they are about my feelings I want to know what foods they sell that may kill mt pet first and formost.

Guys this is just the tip of the iceberg. $15,000,000,000. a year. That's BILLIONS. Someone is making a "Killing". No one really knows whats in these foods and the proof is now coming out in pet deaths.

Chuck

**watt-a-dog** · 03-31-07, 09:48 AM

Nutro's "DRY" pet foods do NOT contain wheat gluten.
Nutro's "DRY"pet foods do NOT contain imported grains.
Nutro's "DRY" pet foods are NOT manufactured by Menu Foods.
None of Nutro's "DRY" pet foods are included on the Menu Foods recall list.
Pet owners should feel safe and confident feeding all Nutro "DRY" pet foods, as well as any Nutro wet foods that are not on the Menu Foods recall list.

The stuff thats recalled/manufactured by Menu is "WET" Foods.

**Chuck** · 03-31-07, 01:54 PM

Hate to bust you bubble but it does include dry food.

Dear Watt-A-Dog,

Please forgive my rudeness but how the heck do you know? Just because they tell you?

Now they have found melomine in the dry foods. In case you guys don't know melomine is the stuff on kitchen counters a brand is Formica and it starts out as a powder. How do we know what they are substituting. Are you there at the factory making sure? Is anyone?

Does Nutro even make their own food or is it private labeled? I understand that you want to protect your business by protecting the mfg but do you really know?

There are over 500 dog food companies how does anyone know what they are substituting to increase their profits. I can show you industry magazines with ads that state "Natural Life has the ingredient that is missing from most pet foods" you would think that they would say "Nutrition" however the missing ingredient is "Profit Margins"

Another company says "Looking For Better Profits" let ProPac show you a better bottom line. Another company says, "It's time for 40%-50% Gross Profit Margins on your own quality brand pet food!

They make these "Profits" by substituting the cheapest **** they can. How do they make 40%-50% profit and undersell the competition, only one way that is selling garbage for pet food. Most garbage is free isn't it great that they can run it through your dogs digestive system and make big money. Who would ever know until somthing like this happens.

How would you know your dog is nourished unless they leave fresh meat in the bowl? Ask 9 out of 10 pet owners if their pet is always hungry and they will tell you they are always at the table looking for food. Is that because they are satiated and satisfied? Ask the same 9 out of ten owners what their pet died from and they will tell you "Cancer". It is not from "Electromagnetic forces".

Don't get me going about pet foods it has been to many years of helping people feed their pets fresh without any profit being made. I have saved hundreds of pets who were literally starving to death by teaching their owners what, how and when to feed.

These companies are large public agri/food companies who answer to their stockholders not to the general public they are concerned with the bottom line not your pet's nutrition. Come on, wake up smell the melomine!

A good book to read is "Foods Pets Die For" by Ann Martin or "The Truth About Pet Foods" by Dr. R.L. Wysong. After reading these books you would never feed your beloved pet anything out of a can or bag or even yourselves.

When it comes to people and their profits they can take a hike for all I care I am a pet advocate and pets need to be nourished just like us. The more "Archtypical" the better. That means "Live Kill" is best then fresh kill then frozen then canned then bagged. If you love them then show it by feeding them the best you can.

If you can not afford it you really can not afford to be a pet owner. By the way you can feed your pets fresh meat cheaper then processed pet food it is just not as convienent.

Chuck

**furrybestjob** · 03-31-07, 03:34 PM

I was considering raw diet, but I was looking at the frozen that is sold in the area and for 5 dogs (a golden, elkhound, aussie, aussie/eskimo and toy poodle), it would cost over $150 per week, way over, which is ridiculous. With my work schedule I rarely even cook for my husband and myself, the dogs wouldn't fare much better. I can afford my dogs...I have one who has addisons and gets monthly shots at $87 a pop, along with prednisolone. I have one who is on MSM, and I spend over $1000 a year on their yearly vet bills, not to mention the money I've spent on training them, doing agility, toys, etc.

I'm a little offended that it could be implied that I am not a good owner, or don't care about my pets because they are not fed raw, and that possibly I shouldn't have them because I can't afford to feed them meat, and choose to feed dry dog food. I've researched to the best of my ability, and with the information provided, and have chosen what works best for me. My dogs have a good quality of life. Is it possible they're life is shortened because of it? Yes, I suppose it is...but what I also know is true that even if I had fed raw to my first poodle, she still would have been dead at a year old (in a fire). I also know my brother almost lost his 2 dogs to taxoplasmosis the vet was certain was due to the raw food.

I was, however, thinking of doing some raw. The man at the food store told me that some raw was better than none. That he feeds dry food, along with some medallions each day, and then complete raw one day a week. Was he just feeding me a line, or does this make sense?

**diamienono** · 03-31-07, 05:27 PM

The pre fab raw diets are really expensive. I have not been able to find a place that will sell me "scraps". I love my dogs. I also had a child hood dog that was a black lab. She lived to be a ripe old age of 17 living on moist and meaty and kibbles and bits. So. The way I see it is if it isn't broke, don't fix it. This tainted dog food is unfortunate, but look at all the human food that has been tainted. Do we stop eating salad or peanut butter. No, we forget about these things rather quickly. I didn't hear about the 50 mill law suites for the spinach crisis. Welcome to the world where **** happens. Is it right. No, but there is not much we can do about it. I feel my adult Eagle Pack holistic and my puppy gets Nutro large breed puppy. The only reason the 2 get different brands is that I prefer the Eagle Pack holistic, but Eagle pack does not make a puppy food that is grain free. Both of my lab have skin issues that were resolved by going grain free. Do I think all dogs should be fed grain free, no. Would I like to in a perfect world feed my dogs a raw diet yes, but I don't have the time nor the money to feed my dogs filet and asparagus. Does that mean I should not have dogs, certanely not. My dogs are well taken care of.
Chuck, I do disagree with you. Just because you feed a raw diet, and I don't and can't afford to does not mean I should not have dogs. What do you consider acceptable scraps? Where do you get these? What veggies and fruits do you feed?

**HoundLover** · 03-31-07, 05:59 PM

premades

premades always will cost MORE because its conveinent for YOU (person buying the premades) to buy. this is because you dont have to chop up,grind,buy and select the ingredients going into the premade foods. this is done FOR you which is why its more expensive. now as far as premades...
depending on the size and how many dogs you have raw might be easier...keep in mind you arent cooking anything...your just cutting it up. i know one lady who has 5 dogs and feeds raw. she also fosters and feeds raw to the fosters as well. how she feeds and how i feed is completely diffrent. she will just put out a package of food (say...a pkg. of chicken breasts...say 5 are in a pkg.) and some ground hamburger then divide the amount up per dog...(say 3 dogs get 1 lb each, then 2 get 2 lbs each.) so thats a total of 7 lbs a day of food. she puts out 7 lbs of food to thaw then just puts it in the correct bowls. this is how she feeds her multi dog household. how I do my food is like this...i buy all his food in bulk when its on sale, (normally chicken legs, chicken breast and thighs, porkchops, any kind of boneless meat, liver and some heart and gizzards) then i DIVIDE his food up into baggies about 8 ozs per baggie then feed him twice a day. easy peasy and with two people doing it it takes about hlf hr 45 mins and i have 4 wks of food already PREBAGGED and seperated. all i have to do is set two meals in the fridge each day for the next day and he's all set to go. if he refuses a meal then hey...thats alright thats just dinner tonight or breakfast tomorrow then. no biggie. now kibble might work for you...but think about it this way...no more hefting 40 or 50 lbs of dog food...now i dont know what kind of food you feed...if you feed a premium brand (ie, innova, canidae, wellness, california natural etc) but a good website to go to is www.onlynaturalpet.com they also offer a delivery service for you.
not meaning to criticize...and NO your not a bad dog owner for feeding kibble...its just with all the hype on kibbles now a days...who knows! *ps i dont know if onlynatural pet carrys nutro...not sure...but they DO say on the website that the brands they carry there is NO reason to worry about them being recalled as they are natural foods. (i think this is what it says).
best of luck
Hound

**hairdevil** · 03-31-07, 06:26 PM

Chuck? it seems to me that you are trying to create a little hysteria here. The company is trying to make a point about its foods..so far..this is what we know. How do you know if you feed your dog raw diet that its healthier? its not. Do you have any idea how our food is processed? you should be more concerned about whats going into our foods...I love my dogs dearly, I feed nutro ultra. I worry about all the additives in our food that we and my daughter eat everyday. If something like this is bound to happen, I would much prefer it to happen to my pet, than my child! and who knows how this happened or was it someones intention? regardless...nutro is doing a damn good job in keeping concerned customers informed. Thats the best any of them can do at this point until they find out the exact cause and source of!

**diamienono** · 03-31-07, 06:42 PM

Thanks for pointing that out Hair. The meat your are feeding could be nasty too. Do you raise all your own cows chickens, fish and veggies and fruit. If you worry too much about all this you will die and early death. If you go to a restaraunt how do you know the staff in the kitchen is in good health or that they don't have roaches or rats. You just have to trust them. We all have different opinions as to what and how we feed ourselves and our animals. That does not make one right and one wrong.

**jaeinn** · 03-31-07, 07:45 PM

Hysterical? hmmm?

I didnt get the impression Chuck was trying to create any hysterics.

It seemed to me he was expressing an opinion and conveying some thoughts from soem books he had read,

While I would disagree with the statement of anything in a bag or can is not good for your pet. We feed Canidae and Merrick and while I dont know exactly every ingredient in their foods I feel cnfident enough after researching and examining the different choices of dog foods these are the 2 I have chosen.

I have thought about and did try feeding our dogs once with a raw food. They did like it very much but Darlene gets nervous about feeding them raw foods. I do not, And after this how can it be any more dangerous than foods with rat poison and plastics in it.

Jason

**Chuck** · 03-31-07, 07:57 PM

There are cheaper alternatives!

The meat that they sell to us is a little more scrutinized then the meat sold to dog food manufacturers.

I did not mean to offend anyone. It seems that we all go to either side of an issue but it is right dead center that works for most.

Remember I said that there are 500 dog food companies. Some are very high quality pet foods made and sold fresh in air tight light tight bags. You might think that Nutro is a premium food but it isn't it is a generic food that is privated labeled and Branded. I am not saying that Nutro is bad food and you should not feed it. There is better for a better price. You just have to do some reasearch.

Some Premium foods are: Wysong, Abady, California Natural, Solid Gold, etc.

We qualify dog foods as:

1. Fresh Foods
2. Frozen Fresh foods
3. Premium Pet Foods
4. Generic Pet Foods

I go by the 1/3 rule. 1/3 dry 1/3 canned and 1/3 fresh.You can feed a Premium Dry Pet Food mixed with Premium canned and what ever you are having for dinner as long as it is not highly seasoned. Like chicken, hamburger, etc.

Find the purveyors of wholesale hamburger meat to the hamburger shops. I can get 70/30 (Lean/fat) in 10 lb. logs for under $20 each. It is range fed. Same with ground chicken and ground Turkey. Eggs are great for dogs, vegies are also good for them.

Try and find the book "Reighning Cats and Dogs" by Pat McKay it tells you everything you can and cannot feed your pet from your own foods.

When you mix the kibble with canned or fresh meat and add some other fresh things like eggs and vegies you are feeding the best you can. Add some Probiotics and they will assimilate more of the nutrition in the food and you will feed less bulk. They will gourge at first but when their bodies feel that they are getting the proper nutrition they will be satiated and satisfied and leave more in the bowl.

About that time you can start giving them a one day fast each week. No chlorinated water as it disrupts the benificial bacteria in their gut used for digestion. And feed as late as possible. You see your dinner is their breakfast. Their dinner should be before you go to sleep and still can let them out for their last walk.

Dogs are scavengers and learned to live on what was left over from the larger carnivours. They will live on bread and water for your love and loyalty that does not mean we have to feed them as cheaply as possible.

Increase the quality of the food add a digestive enzyme and you will see a big difference in their health.

I am sorry if I offended anyone other then the dog food copmpanies that was not my intention.

Chuck
.

**elliemae** · 03-31-07, 08:17 PM

seems to me that any brand of food that is on that list (even if it is just their canned food that has been recalled) is not very concerned about what the heck is in the dry version of the same brand...sorry but i would not trust any of the brands made by Menu....wet or dry!! i personally chose Solid Gold because i was impressed by the fact that they DO care about the 'quality' of the ingredients they use. i could care less how much it cost.

**watt-a-dog** · 04-01-07, 05:23 AM

Chuck, I wasent commenting on wether they were telling the truth the whole truth etc.
I was pointing out that they stated that there DRY foods were not recalled but that there Wet may be. Since you implied that they were saying all there foods were "safe"..
simply put.. they dident say "that"

I dont Know nor did I claim to wether there foods as a whole are safe or not.. You cant even get Nutro over here anyways so it makes no difrence to me or my clients wether or not they are telling the truth or CYAing so I have absilutly no reason whatsoever to "protect them" (allthough IMO I wouldent have any reason to if I was in the US eather)

**hairdevil** · 04-01-07, 06:37 AM

maybe it would be nice if nutro reps would come on board to answer any questions you might have? there is a number to call chuck if you really want some answers..and you should before you start making observations publicly. check them out and let us know..with facts. I personally don't eat ground beef and would never feed it to my dogs. growth hormones, loaded with antibiotics...etc...nasty stuff! I know with my grooming clients that have had horrible skin..I get them to switch to nutro, and within a short time their hair is coming in..scratching gone..shiney coats..major change. And these dogs alot of them were on science diet or Iams. I've seen it myself thats why I am a believer. to each his own! at least we still have a choice in that!

**Helly** · 04-01-07, 06:44 AM

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and opinions are just that. They are neither right or wrong. So I'm going to add mine.

I've done a lot of research on both sides of the raw issue and decided it's not something I am willing to do. Many proponents of raw diets throw out statements that cannot be supported by facts.

For example, dogs are not susceptible to salmonella infection, for various reasons. This is not true. Both the CDC and FDA have done studies that show dogs can and do become infected. Many times the infection is subclinical, and the dogs are carriers. This means they can be infecting your family.

FDA studies of greyhound kennels where raw diets are fed have shown many dogs infected with salmonella, with a morbidity rate up to 100% in puppies.

There is also the little problem of campylobacter. Dogs are most definately susceptible to campylobacter infection. Many of these infections are diagnosed as vaccine resistant parvo, because the symptoms are identical, and campylobacter causes a false positive parvo test result. So the actual numbers of campylobacter infections may be quite a bit higher than suspected.

I know of one Malamute breeder who had her entire kennel come down with campylobacter after feeding raw. She had 8 adult dogs and two litters of puppies...21 dogs in all. The vet bills were astronomical, close to $10,000 when all was said and done. Two puppies did not survive. That's a huge price to pay, any way you look at it.

I also know, from my own experience, that feeding Oli any raw meat, no matter what that meat is, or how small the portion, will trigger a wild gastrointestinal event. And at least one bout of pancreatitis. Cooked chicken is fine. Raw vegetables and fruits are fine. He can eat bread (whole grain) until the cows come home. But don't even think of giving him raw meat.

My guys eat California Natural Herring and Sweetpotato, both dry and canned. Their weight is stable. Their coats are glowing. Their skin is supple, with no flaking or other issues. They have lots of energy. Right now, Whizzy has a little too much energy. The vet says they're both in great shape. I guess it's working, and I'm not going to fix it.

And one last thing (remember, this is only my opinion), the Purina company has been researching animal nutrition for over 100 years, and has spent billions of dollars on said research. Their other animal feeds, horse, cow, goat, rabbit, monkey, to name a few, are all highly regarded. So why do people think they spent all that time and money doing research, just so they can produce ******, inadequate dog and cat food?

Announcement

A Letter from the Nutro Max Co.

A Letter from the Nutro Max Co.

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